Talk:Rita Cetina Gutiérrez

Polish writer

Why is Rita Cetina Gutiérrez in category:19th-century Polish women writers and category:19th-century Polish writers? I couldn't find any mention in the article of any Polish connection, be it origin, any relatives, language of her works, any editions of her works in Poland or even translations to Polish language. --CiaPan (talk) 07:04, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

It was a while ago, but as I made 3 not consistent changes that day:

Category:19th-century women writers ---> Category:19th-century Polish women writers

Category:Women poets ---> Category:Mexican women poets

Category:19th-century poets ---> Category:19th-century Mexican poets

so I think on one of the changes I must have mis-selected from the dropdown (M and P possibly adjacent)

Icarusgeek (talk) 07:58, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

@Icarusgeek: Ah, I see. Thank you for a prompt reply. --CiaPan (talk) 08:05, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

@Koavf: I see you cleaned up unnecessary assignment to categories already: diff=897173740&oldid=895800662 – thank you, too. --CiaPan (talk) 08:05, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

Mention me, and I will come. ―Justin (koavf)❤T☮C☺M☯ 08:06, 15 May 2019 (UTC)

Wiki Education assignment: University Writing 1020 Communicating Feminism MW 1 pm

This article is currently the subject of a Wiki Education Foundation-supported course assignment, between 20 August 2024 and 9 December 2024. Further details are available on the course page. Student editor(s): KassandraVentura (article contribs).

— Assignment last updated by KassandraVentura (talk) 01:03, 17 September 2024 (UTC)

Planned Improvements (Women in Green Good Article Edit-a-thon)

Hi all! I will be working on improving this article as part of the Women in Green Good Article Edit-a-thon in the upcoming days and weeks. Based on a preliminary look at this article, here are some major things I would like to accomplish:

• These web sources seem okay, but if possible, I would prefer to replace them with more reliable ones. Particularly, biographies by Lucrcia Infante Vargas and Piedad Peniche Rivero seem to offer a lot of good information.
• Obviously I would like to fix the broken citation.
• I would like to expand on a few points:
  • Cetina's work with La Siempreviva.
  • Cetina's time with the Instituto Literario de Niña in particular needs to be expanded.
  • Her literary activity, including her poetry, plays, and fiction (she was one of the first women in Mexican history to write a novel).
  • Her contributions to the feminist movement.
  • Anything else that seems relevant on further research.
• Copyedit, as necessary.

I'll be working in my sandbox primarily, and transferring edits as appropriate. If you have any questions, suggestions, or objections, please let me know! I am a new editor, so I might make mistakes. Thanks! Spookyaki (talk) 16:30, 16 October 2024 (UTC)

Okay, improvements made (sorry about the truncated edit summary, decided to do the summary here). Here's what I did:

• Updated picture. The original was quite small, so I uploaded what I'm pretty sure(?) is a higher-res version of the same picture. Hard to tell because the original was so small, to be honest.
• Added signature.
• Expanded on the following content areas:
  • La Siempreviva: the society, the publication, and the school.
  • Cetina's time at the Instituto Literario de Niñas
  • Cetina's poetry
  • Cetina's fiction
  • Cetina's contributions to feminism
  • Cetina's death and legacy
• Expanded lead to match.
• Changed out references. Mostly relied on Infante, Peniche, and various publications by López, but other sources were brought in too.
• Updated Cetina's "selected works" to make them easier to find for curious readers.

Spookyaki (talk) 20:31, 17 October 2024 (UTC)

GA Review

The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

---

This review is transcluded from Talk:Rita Cetina Gutiérrez/GA1. The edit link for this section can be used to add comments to the review.

Nominator: Spookyaki (talk · contribs) 20:35, 17 October 2024 (UTC)

Reviewer: It is a wonderful world (talk · contribs) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I gave this article a skim through and it looks super interesting! I'm also looking forward to learning a little about what Mexico was like at the time. Also, non-US countries are ridiculously under-represented in education biographies. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

For some reason just noticed that I never took the "early life" section out of the sandbox. It's not too long but added it in just now. Sorry for any inconvenience! Spookyaki (talk) 18:29, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I think you accidentally removed it again with this edit: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Rita_Cetina_Guti%C3%A9rrez&diff=prev&oldid=1252522399 It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:32, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

I'll wait until it's added back before doing the spot check and reviewing it. It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:34, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

Am out of town until the 29th, so probably can’t do any major edits until then, but this seemed fairly easy so did add it back in. Spookyaki (talk) 20:44, 25 October 2024 (UTC)

I just finished the spot check and reviewing the last section. I am in no rush so feel free to wait until you have time to address the remaining points. It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:47, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

Passed spot check, I went ahead and fixed the minor issues I found in the "Early life" section, so I can pass this now. It is a wonderful world (talk) 22:16, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

Prose clock

Lead

I reckon "feminist" should be linked It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Is "liveforever" meant to link to a genus? It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Yes, I didn't elaborate too much on the name in the article because it didn't seem directly relevant to Cetina. Maybe I could add an explanatory footnote. López discusses it in her article on Julia:

...La Siempreviva was not a fortuitous name, assigning it this name carries a great symbolic charge. It refers to a medicinal plant whose relevant aspect is its perennial, permanent and above all healing state. The name surely refers to the mission of the “siemprevivas”, tireless beings, of struggle and in struggle and who count on the “balm” for women; the balm of knowledge. It is also worth mentioning that resorting to a flower to name themselves recalls the romantic ideal. The flower is a symbol of women, of their candor, fragility and beauty; beauty that will be exalted and covered by knowledge. Thus, these transformed women disguised themselves with apparent fragility so as not to break the masculine paradigm in an abrupt manner and to continue with their progressive intentions, that is, the main mission of their purposes was to give a new direction to the feminine condition through the promotion of education and professionalization of women...

Spookyaki (talk) 13:27, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

You could add a footnote if you would like, but I would also be happy with it staying the way it is. I assumed it would be something like that but questioned it because Wikipedia page says the Genus is native to Africa and Europe. It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:09, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

The term "public school" is actually a type of private school in the UK (yes, very confusing). Maybe change to "state school" or link to the state school article to be clear. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I think it probably makes sense to keep "public school" since that's closer to the Mexican Spanish (escuelas públicas), but I did go ahead and link it to state school. Spookyaki (talk) 13:35, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Two years later, she left the Instituto as well, returning[returned] to the La Siempreviva school It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

including budget cuts and harassment from the state government: "harassment" is a strong word which doesn't seem to be supported by the text body. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Cetina is also considered to be one Mexico's first feminists due to her contributions to women's education and her writing: By whom? WP:WEASEL It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I added attribution for this statement in the body in the article, should I also add it to the lead? Spookyaki (talk) 13:57, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

No, I shouldn't have challenged this, for some reason I didn't check the article body for attribution. It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:10, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

Early life

Mérida, Yucatán, Mexico: Should have a comma after Mexico (MOS:GEOCOMMA)

receiving assistance from a man named Domingo Laureano Paz, a family friend who helped educate the girls: Excessive detail

Link "philologist"

La Siempreviva

Link "patriarchal ideas" It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Should "Amigas" schools be linked? They seem like they would be notable. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Link "catechism" It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Instituto Literario de Niñas

I love the detailed footnotes you have included. They really add depth and help understanding. I have never seen them used so effectively before. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Thank you! I'm glad they were so effective. Spookyaki (talk) 13:33, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Return to La Siempreviva and the Instituto

"income not sufficient for its maintenance.": Needs inline citation It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Link "measles epidemic" either to a specific event or just the measles article. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Link "pedagogy" and maybe "natural science" It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Poetry

"Cristobela." requires an inline citation per WP:QUOTE. Several other quotes in this paragraph require inline citations. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I don't see any other quoted material in that paragraph. Is this referencing the quotes from "Tres de marzo" in the next paragraph? If so, the citation is technically fn 22, a sentence down, though I could copy it for both parts. Would that make sense? Spookyaki (talk) 13:48, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I think you are right, I must have been talking about the paragraph down. Not sure why I said "several" either! Also the footnote citation is fine. It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:15, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

Link "El Recreo del Hogar"? It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Link "Instituto Bibliográfico Mexicano"? It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Link "nationalistic" It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

with some referring to her: Is it possible to be more specific than "some"? It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

The source says:

Indeed, for her epic poetry of deep and vibrant notes that sang the glories of the nation and progress, she has been called "singer of the homeland."

So there's not a whole lot to go on, though I did find a specific instance of Menéndez saying it. Spookyaki (talk) 13:32, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I think the way you have written it is actually fine, I was concerned about Wikipedia:WEASEL, but it is so non-controversial and minor that I think it is fine. It would be weird to attribute the saying specifically to Menéndez when it was used by not just him. It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:17, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

"cantora de la patria.": Include translation as done in the lead. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Fiction

Link "romantic novel" It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Contributions to feminism

Link "emancipation" It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I think "Elvia Carrillo Puerto" should be linked again, since the first instance was right back in the lead. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Death and legacy

Looks good :) It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Selected works

Looks good :) It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Sources clock

Health/formatting clock

[9] has a harv/sfn error. It does not link to the source because the sfn lists the year as 2015 instead of 2014. I recommend installing the script User:Trappist the monk/HarvErrors which detects these errors automatically. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Thanks for linking me this! I think I saw that the page was tagged as having a harv-error, but I could not for the life of me figure out where it was. Spookyaki (talk) 13:37, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Glad it helps :) It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:18, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

Reliability clock

Looks to be a great range of sources. I will continue with the source review and spot check when I have time. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Spot check clock

I am using translation services for this, so it is quite likely there may be some false flags, and I couldn't verify some of it completely.

[1, 2]: It would be easier to verify if [1] was inserted straight after "administrations." Also, where did "or 14" come from? The source says she was 13.

You're right. I thought one of the sources said she was 14, but checking again I see that isn't the case. Removed it and moved fn 1. Spookyaki (talk) 20:46, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

[3]: Not sure how this supports the text.

Some of Ramos's occupational info came from that source, specifically that he was a philologist. Can remove that info if entirely it seems like WP:EXCESSDETAIL. Spookyaki (talk) 20:46, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

No that's fine! I think it was just me getting a bit confused with the translation It is a wonderful world (talk) 22:10, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

[5]: Y

[15a, b]: Y

[28, 29]: [29] says Vigil died in 1909, but [28] says he published the poem compilation in 2010?

1910. "...such as the anthology Poetisas Mexicanas, compiled by José María Vigil in 1910 for the celebration of the centennial anniversary of Mexican independence, which discusses the poetic stature of the then-deceased Rita Cetina..." Also tracks since the Cry of Dolores took place in 1810. Still a minor discrepancy that I can't quite account for, but my assumption is that the particular edition being referenced was published posthumously? Spookyaki (talk) 20:46, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

I would also guess that's the case. Either way, nothing you can do about the sources not matching. It is a wonderful world (talk) 22:11, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

[36]: Y

[43]: Should be pages 28-29 I think

I believe you're right. Fixed. Spookyaki (talk) 20:46, 26 October 2024 (UTC)

Scope clock

The plot summary of Julia could be considered unnecessary detail, but I like it and the article is otherwise short, so I support keeping it. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Right, yeah. That makes sense. There was one source that talked about it at length, but not enough material for it to warrant its own article. It seemed like an important piece of history, though, being one of the first books published in Mexico by a woman, so I wanted to go into a little more detail about it. Spookyaki (talk) 13:39, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Copyvio clock

12.3% on earwig, it identifies no too close paraphrasing. I will check for any other too close paraphrases on the source spot check. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Stable Y

Media Y

Is there no images of La Siempreviva school, or Instituto Literario de Niñas? It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I couldn't find any that seemed suitable for the article unfortunately, I did look. I did find this street sign, but unsure if it's related to the school. I also found a picture of a plaque going up at the address of the La Siempreviva school, but no idea about the copyright status and the images didn't seem relevant enough to ask for permission. Spookyaki (talk) 13:53, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

That's fine, unfortunate though. It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:20, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

Captions Y

Tags Y

Correctly tagged. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

Suggestions

The following points are not needed for GA promotion.

La Siempreviva desperately needs a copyedit. It seems like it would only take you a few minutes given your knowledge of the subject matter. It is a wonderful world (talk) 10:09, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

I was considering overhauling that article at some point in the future. Maybe I'll give it a brief copyedit first, as you suggest, and then I'll probably come back to it later. Spookyaki (talk) 13:55, 21 October 2024 (UTC)

It looks so much better! I wasn't expecting you to do so much. It is a wonderful world (talk) 19:23, 24 October 2024 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.